It wasn’t, I just saw @Navynuke99’s comment above, agreed with it, and thought it would be a fun badge for us all to have (plus you can use it as a title as well in your profile). 
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So in the ED forums I saw talk of the targeting systems for the AV8B NA. I was sort of expecting either a ground radar or a Lightening-like pod - is that not the case? I think the Zeus was saying the NA just uses an optical targeting, and that it isn’t quite like the A10C with it’s SPI’s and SOI’s - anyone know?
So the NA has no radar. Its skill set is very much like the Mirage’s. CCIP, CCRP, ,Rockets, and LGB’s with a Man in the Loop.
@near_blind I think mentioned earlier in the thread that Razbam has plans to upgrade it to a Plus model when the ground radar tech is finished.
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I found the AV-8 Harrier Tactical Manuals here:
Looking at the ED thread here:
https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?p=3169541#post3169541
…it looks like RAZBAM are targeting (heh) the references of the public info from ~2002 ish. Fascinating stuff so far.
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Ah, ok. So the AV-8B N/A is the updated version for Night Attack (NVG, NAVFLIR, LITENING II TPOD etc., the one used during Desert Storm) but doesn’t have the APG-65 ground radar and is just pure optical targeting, with even the targeting pod more an added extra?
The Plus or AV-8B Radar (ground radar APG-65) is the All Weather updated variant, which RAZBAM plan a bit later with ED (as same sort of radar used in F/A-18C)?
Then manuals I linked to above, describes the radar use, so must be the plus I guess.
(I sort of know the UK GR5/7/9 variants better, the USMC stuff is a bit of mystery still).
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And Thrustmaster has the Control stick part of that covered. Going to be very good times.
I would love to see them make a throttle that has a detachable grip as well. Seems it could be lucrative for them (I have no idea if that’s true but I want it to be) and would be great (expensive) for us. Just attach the grips for the module you are flying.
I am also excited to fly a “simpler” model first and then move up to a glass cockpit version later. Sounds limiting I know. But I can also sell it to myself as being like going from the Su-25A to the -T. I am not ashamed to admit that I get intimidated sometimes by all the MFD pages in a module and it can put me off from learning it.
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Pretty much. The B+ basically came about when the USN decided to upgrade all their F/A-18s to the C model, which uses the upgraded/redesigned APG-73 radar. Observing the Navy was suddenly flush with APG-65s (the radars on the F/A-18A), the USMC scooped them up, as they had a bunch of F/A-18As. I don’t know exactly the chain of events, but somehow McD was commissioned to start putting them into the nose AV-8Bs to make them all weather bombers, and give them expanded (albeit relatively limited) air to air capacity. The European AV-8B customers (Spain and Italy), caught whif and thought it was a smashing idea, and further funded development to include AIM-120s and ideally otherstuff that didn’t pan out.
Keep scrolling. Generally the manuals will keep information for all in service aircraft at the time of printing. The one you posted covers ARBS et. al. below the APG-65 Section.
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Ah got it, I think. So the Angle Rate Bombing System (ARBS) is the line of sight optical thing, with the N/A using ‘Dual Mode Tracker’ (DMT) rather than radar, which sounds like a image-based visual targeting system that is built in as a camera in the nose, rather than a ‘big eye’ separate targeting pod. So maybe LITENING II to go find things, and then the ARBS DMT to go view and lock (using a laser or just image contrast) and then the putting the thing on the thing can happen.
In fact @fearlessfrog, I am not sure you know this, and I don’t recommend you dig through that 149 post thread, but Razbam originally posted the version to build as a poll and the GR. 7/9 won. There was much rejoicing across the pond until they came back and changed it to the NA due to the targeting pods and weapons fit being too much for them to tackle.
Almost a British Harrier…
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So close!
Actually, I’m like you, in that I’d prefer an early variant first, just to get my feet wet (repeatedly) and then get more buttons to press later on. I don’t think an AIM-120 variant was ever a good idea anyway. 
I’m firmly in the ‘Church of Systems’ school of flight simming though, where gameplay, drama and fun come a sad third place compared to (1) Learning what all the buttons do, (2) Wallowing in acronyms and (3) Doing stuff.
@Fridge and I were joking in TS the other night that we are both excited for the Harrier because we realized that 80-90% of our flight time is pattern practice and whats better than VTOL pattern practice? Plus boats!
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Ramp. All of the excitement and none of the breakdowns.
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I’m going to preface this I’m guessing on a fair bit of this, I’m not exactly in tip-top shape critical thinking wise atm, and I don’t want to look like an ass in front of the resident forum Harrier Pilot 
.
I’m assuming the actual attack logic is similar to the Hornet’s in that there is a logical object called a designation, which is roughly analogous to the SPI from the F-16/A-10. It can be a waypoint, coordinates, a radar fix, a TGP position, or a position designated directly from the HUD, but it basically is something the Mission Computer recognizes as the thing you would like most to kill at the moment.
If I had to guess your options in the AV-8B would be selection INS coordinates as a target directly, selecting a target utilizing the Angle Rate Bombing System (ARBS), a compilation IRTV unit and LST in the nose, using the TGP, or selecting a target via the HUD.
INS ought to be easy, there’s a MFD command to designate a waypoint as a target.
ARBS as you’ve found out, has two basic modes. The first is the Dual Mode Tracker (DMT), which is a TV that locks on to contrast. Using angle and elevation information from the aircraft it estimates range and can generate a CCRP (AUTO in the McD product line), or CCIP Lead). The second is LST, which is Laser Spot Tracking, or latching onto a spot provided by another source.
TGP is the mode I know the least about, but this should be the most similiar to the A-10 (It’s the same pod). My understanding from the lack of mention in this manual, and comments by Zeus, is that it’s more or less “after market”, with less stream lined integration compared to the other sensors.
Finally I assume there is the ubiquitous ability to select targets directly off the HUD.
Thus ends me talking out my rear.
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Here is a question out of left field - The castle switch on the F-18/Harrier grip looks , I don’t know, less ergonomic to use? Is it better or worse than what we are used to for a thumb switch, or is it designed for a specific function? Is it also CMS or does McD do it very different?
The castle up in pic of RAZBAM AV-8B Harrier II - #537 by fearlessfrog looks a bit like a combination of the A-10C Coolie hat for switching MFD’s and the TMS. It’s marked as the ‘Sensor Select Switch’. Is that the one you meant?
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So it does different things in different jets.
In the F/A-18 it’s function is similar to the DMS in the A-10/F-16. Essentially it shifts TDC Priority (the clit mouse) controls between the four primary displays: the HUD, the Left and Right DDIs (MFDs), and the MPCD (Map screen). Additionally, depending on which MFD, and what that MFD is displaying, it has additional functions. For instance, say your TDC Control is set to the MPCD. (which would be castle switch down), and you press down again. This automatically flips the MFD display from the default HSI, to the Situational Awareness display, which is a sort of fusion between your radar, TGP, RWR, and map. If you had the HSI selected on your left DDI, and you castle switched left, the same thing would happen.
If you have your A/A radar selected on the right screen, for example, using the castle switch will then command the close combat modes for the radar. E.G. Up Commands Vertical Scan, etc.
Finally if you’re in CCIP mode for any sort of munition, selecting the HUD as the TDC Priority display will activate AGR (Air Ground Ranging) radar mode.
Tl;dr, it’s highly situational. For further reference, CMS is controlled by a hat on the throttle, and what we consider the “CMS” button on the stick is actually a quick select for air to air weapons.
The Harriers seems to be a quick select for specific sensors.
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Yep, I’m going to need that Thrustmaster F/A-18 and AV-8B new grip pre-order button (or ideally new combo package) real soon…
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So clearly all I had to do was look at the diagram you posted to answer my question. It is Friday and I have had a pint so I apologize.
I had read in a couple places mention of the castle switch and assumed the term referred to the thumb switch on the left side lower of the stick. Now that I look at the diagram clearly it is the Rook switch (my alliteration, and much better in my opinion) top right for Sensors.
So it is the A/A switch that doesn’t look that ergonomic to me, or at least just different than how the falcon/warthog switches are laid out.
Also - McD lays it out very different. Should be interesting.
Edit: Thanks @near_blind that explains it for me.
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