But isn’t that argument counter productive? Your friends were on the bridge, and they chose not to cross to the other side because of irrational fear. Perhaps we all can do a better job allaying those fears.
Some will never want to cross, some dont want to, some will after time, offering more for people to take those first steps in DCS isnt a bad thing, and isnt hurting anyone.
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Except the poor F-4E 
But that’s a valid point 
One other thing to keep in mind: MAC will probably offer all these aircraft for ~$50 for the complete set. I know, that’s rather silly, but some people seriously balk at the idea of paying $50 for a single aircraft, let alone $80 for something like the bug. I don’t think we can really forget that to take advantage of the detailed modules, you really do need some specific hardware, like a full HOTAS with pedals and TIR. That’s a serious investment in hardware, plus the additional cost of the module. Throw in the time commitment and now your audience is even narrower.
So, someone decides that $50 is fair for all the aircraft, goes for it, the sale is made and it gives them more than enough to stay busy. They’ll then be exposed to others who have the more advanced modules who can then give them a perspective on what the greater complexity entails, without being limited to the TF-51D and Su-25T from DCS World.
In the end, there’s nothing really new about any of these aircraft or the module, it’s just a simplification of existing aircraft. That is pretty easy to implement and do, taking little if any development time away from advanced modules. It’s a good business decision and good investment.
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The F-16 leapfrogged the F-4E, dont blame MAC 
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Boy have I been itching for the Cobra or the Hind these days… I hope we something about their development soon.
As @Franze mentions, there can be a SIGNIFICANT cash outlay for controllers etc to be able to really use some of the modules. The A-10c can be flown with keyboard commands, a POV hat switch and simple joystick. It’s also incredibly difficult, and IMO not fun. The number of keyboard commands just for the different hat switches is ridiculous. Try keeping SA without track IR, along with using the keyboard, it makes most combat scenarios down right punitive.
A good HOTAS setup, can cost more than an entire gaming console. The A-10C is a bit unique in exactly how much is mapped to a HOTAS in the real world, but even something simpler like the Harrier requires someone be pretty comfortable using a keyboard if they don’t have a full setup. Sure you can argue that if you’re serious about FS’ing you “need” a good setup, but the reality is we are on the far end of the bell curve, probably outside of 3 standard deviations.
Think about a lot of flight “sims” back in the so called golden age. Tornado, EF2000, anything with Janes in the title, etc. You really didn’t need to use shift, ctrl, or alt. Let alone Lshift, rshift, etc. We managed to do a lot of flying and fighting with systems abstractions that lent themselves to simple keyboard use. I think we’re kind of shooting ourselves in the foot at as community trying to bring in newcomers, if we don’t have that level of accessibility in modern titles.
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Exactly! I think to even get close to the gear one would need to tackle things seriously, the entry level equipment would be about $350. That’s for a HOTAS+pedals+TIR and it’ll leave a lot to be desired. So how is someone with just a basic stick going to be able to really enjoy it? It’ll be a clunky experience for sure; it most certainly is for me whenever I forget my TIR, and I have the full HOTAS setup to boot.
Well to be honest, I spent a lot of time using the T Flight Hotas X, without rudder pedals, and honestly with modern aircraft, you can survive with a twist stick depending on what you are doing. If someone wanted to stay there, as much as its hard to see from our point of view with 600+ bucks of flight sim gear on and under our desks, it is possible.
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Yep, I have a full CH setup with TIR in my man cave. My wife and I actually still enjoy being around each other, so I actually do most of my flying on my laptop in my recliner with just a twist grip joystick and no TIR. Even then my joystick is a $100+ and would certainly be a specialty item (in the sense no one domestically carries it, as well as in the sense it was over $100). At this point in my life, I have about 30 years of FS’ing under my belt, and alot of it using the keyboard and such. I can make it work and have fun, because I’m used to these limitations and I fly AC that fit those limitations. Heck a twist grip and throttle weren’t even a thing for a major portion of my FS’ing career.
Assuming a reasonable desktop and a capable joystick like mine, if I knew nothing about FS’ing and picked up the A-10C, I would be sorely disappointed at my inability to have success in most combat scenarios. Even with what I know about FS’ing and many years using the keyboard, I still stay away from the A-10C due to incredible amount of keybinds it takes to be effective without a full HOTAS. Combat flight sim’ing in it’s current format requires a lot of gear to do well.
I do a decent bit of sim racing, but I never put the same money into gear for it that I did FS’ing. I can get away with that and even be mildly competitive with a game pad. I need an axis for gas, brakes, and steering, that’s it. The rest I can muddle through on the keyboard or assign to a button on my controller. $15 and I’m able to pretty much enjoy the full feature set of a racing game. Do I enjoy racing with my FFB wheel? Sure, but somethings a gamepad is what you’ve to work with. Currently there really isn’t anything to bridge that gap and provide an easy pickup go type experience beyond arcade flight games.
FC3 with it’s press 7 to go to A2G, D to cycle weapons, and C for cannon, meant I could realistically get my A-10A or SU-25 up in the air killing targets and only need to know 3 keys. I think we’ve kind of lost sight of how attractive that can be.
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Now read this again, but slowly. That’s the point.
My inner lobes are kinda pretzeled today, but it’s kind of like starting off with the lite aircraft, learning them a bit, then graduating to the advanced ones? If so, I’m in full agreement. I will add the caveat I wish we had more options for advanced two seat trainer aircraft, especially for carrier capable ones. Yeah, you can refly as many times as you want, but for a lot of people it doesn’t really click when you keep doing the same thing wrong over and over again. Being there and having someone else who knows how to do it show you the ropes makes all the difference in the world. And if we’re aiming for as much realism as possible, why should we deviate from how things are done for real?
The whole discussion about realism is an interesting one.
Quite frankly, where’s the realism in letting people play with full fidelity DCS modules, without giving them years of government funded training?
Everybody wants to blow virtual stuff up, but very few want to read a book about how to do it.
It’s just a question of following the money.
I read somewhere that the FC series are the best selling DCS modules.
If this is the case, this should tell us that we are the minority.
It should also tell us something about the mindset at ED.
If ”easy” modules sell better, why don’t they go with that? I mean, I guess it would be easier and cheaper to produce these modules, as well as easier to sell.
Yet, ED&co continue to make full fidelity modules, catering to the minority. Yes, that would be us.
Now, taking full fidelity modules and sell easy versions of the same seems like pure genious to me.
We, the minority, get more people to help us pay our bills.
Let’s face it. If the money did lie in fully realistic aircraft modules, everybody would be making and selling them.
I mean, I wish that was the case! But, again, reality…
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$80 should buy me 5 minutes of time in the cockpit of an F/A-18C, right? Or would it be less? I believe the per flight hour cost of a UH-60 is in the realm of $2k, so ya figure… 2 minutes? I can work with that. Yeah… 
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Exactly! It doesn’t add up…
Hence why it’s so important to have trainer modules! The prospective player needs to be indoctrinated by locking them in the cockpit with a rabid monkey hopped up on speed, while memorizing the startup procedure as well as communicating with the tower for permission to flip every switch. Once they’ve done that, they’ll be considered hardcore rivet counters and we’ll go to the next phase: indoctrination! From there, they’ll have to crawl across the floor of a seedy strip joint to lick the squadron commander’s boots, then bark like a dog and drink from the toilet in the vain hope of getting a decent callsign that doesn’t offend the delicate sensibilities of the nearest politician!
… What? Are you saying that rivet counters don’t do that?
Nah, down here we prefer a live cougar.
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This would be a good offering.
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I always loved the cheerful optimism of sidewinders on a vark
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