IL2 VR Zoom

I tried to enter a discussion about this over at the IL2 forum but Jason has closed all mentions on the subject. So for some background: Players in 2D have very high levels of zoom. That’s true of most flight sims. VR tends to have a single, low level of zoom–not, I don’t believe, because devs hate VR users. Zoom-ability in VR comes with technological limits. In the case of IL2 VR zoom is set at 1.5x–considerably less than what can be achieved in 2D. If you play in multiplayer this is a big disadvantage. But IL2 implements VR so stunningly that I just put up with getting my backside handed to me every flight. Two years ago a mod was introduced by “3dgmoto” that allowed up to 10x (perhaps a bit excessive.) I picked a nice balance at 5x and the game was changed for me in much the same way that it was changed when VR itself was introduced. I could now spot ground and air targets at something close to the acuity of what I was able to do with trackir. Every time the game updates substantially it tends to break 3dgmoto’s mod. This latest update was particularly big and I was not surprised to find it broken again. With history as a guide, it would probably take a week or two for the mod to get fixed. But in the meantime a vocal group of players cried “foul” and called the mod a cheat. Jason agreed and removed the discussion where updates to the mod were posted. It’s his game and his right. IL2, especially the old version, has always been ripe with flight-model fiends and rivet-counting trolls who’ve enjoyed occasional pampering on the part of developers. It sucks. IL2 is a gorgeous sim and Jason has generally managed the franchise nicely. But I can’t go back. He could just as well have eliminated VR support entirely and it would have had about the same impact for me. Was it a cheat? Maybe it was. Certainly the super-zoom available in 2D is. There is seeing. And there is not seeing. I can no longer see in a way I find playable once I became accustomed to how good the game can be when I am no longer the last guy to spot stuff.

EDIT: Further reading indicates that as of now 777 are not preventing the mod (should it get fixed). They just aren’t allowing a discussion of it on the forum. That may make finding it difficult. If I learn more I will post it here.

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That is a pity , particularly since DCS has lately introduced multi-level VR zoom .
One way to mitigate the problem might be Flying Circus . WW1 dogfighting necessarily takes place in closer quarters , and flying open-cockpit VR is awesome .
I concede that bouncing or avoiding being bounced would remain more difficult , however…

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Have you tried the native VR zoom in the latest IL2 update? The devs increased the magnification dramatically. Not sure what the new value is, but I would guess around 5X.

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It’s better than it was. But if that really is 5x then what I previously thought was 5x with the mod must have been something closer to 10x.

That’s pretty harsh. It was (and hopefully still will be) a great asset for VR flying. Helped a bit on the performance front too. Saw a few threads on this floating around and the general, reasonable consensus was that it simply matched the zoom available in 2D. Not sure how that’s a “cheat.” Really hope they can resolve this. Absolute best case scenario is they integrate this into the base game. That way, VR flyers get the benefits, and you can’t complain that it breaks the game any more.

It would seem that this mod has brought forth a larger issue, that of having mods that don’t trip the “mods off” function of IL2:

So it looks like they’re going to reevaluate mods that change the gameplay without requiring the game to be in modded mode.

Also, according to the developers, both flat screen and VR users are given a FOV of 30 degrees at max zoom:
https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/61701-game-version-4006-discussion-deferred-shading-yak-9-su-152-new-campaigns-4k-for-4-planes/page/17/?tab=comments#comment-947158

The mod in question is claimed as giving in excess of that 30 degrees for VR users.

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Is that even a proper comparison? Most VR users are already starting a with a less wide viewing area. So going to 30 from the lower viewing area = less of a multiplier. Well anyway. Whatever they do some people will be pleased, others pissed. I guess its clear where I sit. As long as the Jastanauts are happy, all is well.

I’m not sure; it would depend on what a VR headset’s base viewing angle/focal length is. Bearing in mind that once you start getting into these sorts of things, the numbers can get quite entertaining. When they say 30 degrees FOV, that begs the question of based on what focal length? Only real way to know would be to do a side by side comparison of a monitor to a VR headset at the comparative maximum FOVs. It’s possible that monitor users have a greater level of zoom compared to VR users, depending on how the math works out.

Who’s the *ss now? Me! That’s who. :stuck_out_tongue:

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They added that zoom just to make you look bad! :wink:

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I’ll take it!

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Neat, but have to work out how to control it in VR

Tangentially - I wish I knew more about the IL-2 campaign system because I could see the appeal of something if it was pretty dynamic. I loved the small amount of dabbling in VR I did with IL-2 last year, but…“my cup runneth over” as it were with sims and games right now and it is a struggle to branch out.

Il2 campaigns are not much of a game tbh. More like a mission generator that forms a chain of missions.

It does track units however, so you can thin em out some. They will get reinforced pretty quickly tho.

Perhaps the vaunted air marshal addition they’re working on will change it up somewhat.

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I must have missed something… Tell me more!

I agree with @schurem’s comments. But would like to add that there are some good scripted campaigns too.
The career mode is a pretty good campaign generator, but doesn’t have much of a story to it.

I have gone through periods where I enjoyed the Career. I have done a dozen or so now but have only survived two to completion. Mostly though the experience is pretty stale. A fun task is to review the autogen mission in the editor. It is shockingly complex with hundreds of active units. But I am blind to nearly all of it as I fly. A more detail-oriented player would probably have a better appreciation for the Career because they follow the movements of forces on the map and read the news stories, all making them feel in the moment. I tried doing that but still find the experience to be occasionally sterile.

If the IL2 system was used in a modern sim like Falcon, it might be more effective. Because then we could see forces on the map real time. And sensors and radio would better detect ground and air units—filling up the world around the player in ways he is aware of. So the loneliness maybe less a failure of the mission generation and more the nature of air warfare before radar and heavy radio traffic.

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Off topic, but since it came up, my perfect WW2 campaign is fully dynamic with a ton of crazy scripted events all wrapped up in an RPG lite wrapper to grow and update my squadron while acting as a strategic commander between flights :slight_smile:

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I find the long flights to and from the mission area calming in combination with a good podcast. Some radio chatter wouldn’t go amiss. It’s one of the things that made Falcon 4.0 so great, the constant stream of radio calls.

Excellent idea my man. I suppose that it depends on the designer and time/theater, but some are not too bad. To be historically correct, the late war East front should often be a short flight. In the The German Aces Speak series of books, the pilots describe often getting into dogfights almost immediately after takeoff, especially during times of the FLOT moving rapidly.

Beach,

You are referring to our Pilot Career. Our Campaigns (Scripted Campaigns) are something quite different. But I highly suggest you check out Pat Wilson’d Campaign generator if you don’t like our Career. It’s one man’s vision over MANY years with our direct support and encouragement to use our mission tech to it’s fullest. https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/forum/99-pat-wilson-campaign-generator/

We don’t have the resources to constantly tweak our Career system, but Pat is a gifted programmer and his generator has many of the features our Career mode has and more sometimes. We consider it part and parcel of our IL-2 product line.

Jason

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