and this is why I have to keep score manually 
got it squared away
2 Likes
Welcome to Mudspike! 
1 Like
Speaking of which I’ve been meaning to ask, any idea on how the scoring is going to work? What points distribution are you looking at? Simple sum of the 5 stages, or a “best of X results” thing? Do DNFs count for points (you’re still “8th”), or are they a 0? Just curious.
1 Like
Ok, so here we go.
The overall championship will be broken up in 3 stages and 1 championship race.
The 3 stages will have 4 races each. Points for each rally will be awarded using the WRC point system.
25-18-15-12-10-8-6-4-2-1
These will be tallied up after 4 races to award stage points. (Stage 1 rallies 1-4, Stage 2 rallies 5-8, Stage 3 rallies 9-12)
1st - 10 points
2nd - 9 points
3rd - 8 points
etc, etc, etc,
after Stage 3 is completed I will add up Stage 1, 2 and 3 scores.
For example the final stage standings could look something like this.
Driver 1 - 29 points (2 stage victories, 1 2nd)
Driver 2 - 28 points (1 stage victory, 2 2nds)
Driver 3 - 24 points (3 3rds)
etc…
So what about that final championship race? Point differentials will be converted into a time penalty of +5 seconds for each point difference.
Using the example standings above
1st place; +0:00
2nd place; -1 point +05 seconds
3rd place; -5 points +25 seconds
I will manually add the time to your final time to get the actual winner and places. I think that doing things this way would both reward placing well in each stage, while still technically giving everyone one last shot at glory, so we don’t have people completely packing it up before the final race.
I’ll post a poll where we can pick the championship track shortly.
If I didn’t explain something well enough don’t be afraid to ask, or any complaints, comments or whatevers, launch away.
2 Likes
The vote is live now below, please keep any comments over here though.
1 Like
Lot of silence, not sure if that is good or bad. I do want to add in a bonus stage for each rally, winner nets 1 extra point for the rally.
I’ll attempt to use @dicebot to pick a random stages from Scotland and Argentina
1 Like
Please not Argentina in Group Bs.
1 Like
Scotland was fast and narrow and full of logs. I know the danger all too well as I drifted into a pile maybe a minute and a half into the rally and my run promptly ended.
Congrats to @Roo for 1st
@chipwich for 2nd
@Aginor for 3rd
The power stage was stage 2, sorry for the retroactive addition worth 1 bonus point. Which went to Roo
Next up is indeed Argentina, with Stage 11 being the Bonus Stage. We’re going to run them all, so don’t worry I’ll have to run ones I hate too.
Standings after Scotland
Roo - 26 (25 +1)
Chipwhich - 18
Aginor - 15
Keets - 12
Magn Ovr - 10
521 - 8
TeTeTe - 6
Mudcat - 4
5 Likes
Sorry for not replying sooner, I usually only get to jump on here in the evenings on work days, and yesterday my internet conked out on me. 
Anyways, Mudcat had the unenviable job of coming up with a points system that doesn’t let someone run away with the championship, doesn’t mean you’re completely out if you have a bad rally, and keeps everyone engaged. I think you’ve done a fine job.
My only potential critique is that everything hinges on the last rally. I do like that even if you have a horrible run up to that point, your maximum handicap is “only” 2.5 minutes, and you can still win with a hail Mary run. That said, if you retire from the last race, you’re done. Clip a corner too much, hit a stray rock, or some other unlucky break with terminal damage? Poof, everything’s gone. Adds quite a lot of pressure, and somewhat nullifies everything up till then.
Not sure how to rectify that, perhaps double/triple/quadruple points for the finally rally? Don’t really know. Of course, I’m perfectly happy to run with the proposed rules, just wanted to see if it was worth discussing.
Also, am I understanding correctly that the whole 13 event rally will be in the Group Bs? Will definetly need some new pants by the end of that. 
3 Likes
I didn’t respond because I didn’t understand it fully until we’d done the first rally. Sorry Mudcat, I should have said. I think it looks a good way of doing things and the bonus stage is a great idea.
Now where did I put my dunce’s hat?
1 Like
That was my biggest question, was being fair enough to the top. In the scenario of clipping a rock or flubbing the last rally, the only way that could really impact the top spot unfairly imo is if they were to have hypothetically clinched the title beforehand under different scoring scenarios.
Of course it moderately effects if previously the top driver only needed to finish in say 4th place to clinch. You still could and still win with a 4th place in the final rally in this scenario as well. I dunno, it’s the main driver for me asking for votes so we can decide on a final race early on, so people can really get that course down in the time leading up to it if they wanted since it will be important.
Yes, we’re doing all group b’s and all the same cars we started with. I was going to do the 2000cc one in the alt rally too, but I think I’m just going to hold off till the fall before adding more and keeping it lighter over the summer for now. We can do a mix again next time out if people want or just 2000cc.
I have a few more ideas I can implement to flesh things out more. I’ll have to dig a bit deeper than bugging people I already knew to join up 
No worries, I wasn’t sure I explained it enough to start (I wasn’t sure I explained it enough this time around, but I think I managed). I’ve been trying to get off my rear more and more the last few weeks around the house so haven’t just been planted to the chair like I was in March and April 
I do have one question for folks with the bonus stage though, should the point go to the individual rally points total or the stage total?
2 Likes
I appreciate the insight to your thinking. You’re doing the best you can with an imperfect system, and I applaud you for that. I may end up driving that final rally in Granny mode just to make sure I finish, but hey, them’s the rules that we all have to play by, so at least it’s equal.
1 Like
@Mudcat I voted for the wrong race. I meant to vote for New England but I accidental voted for New Zealand.
My rally was horrible. The car wouldn’t go or turn either. I forgot to calibrate my wheel on the PS4, once I did it was slightly better but still not great. Stage 5 I bumped the bridge, rolled backwards and slid sideways down a hill. Guess I slid too far as my car was unrecoverable and that was that. There is always next time.
1 Like
If that vote is for New England then I think it’s safe to announce that as the final destination, with 4 votes out of 8 racers and nothing else having more than one vote.
I was afraid we’d get 1 vote for each
New England it is!
1 Like
I too apologise for not responding. I’m always pretty laid back about these things as opposed to when I’m actually driving, then I become a bag of nerves.
I think it would be a shame for the top driver to lose it all on one mistake right at the end but then that is what makes sport so exciting and unpredictable. But speaking from a personal perspective I would always have a competitive interest regardless of my position or times due to always aiming to catch or resist the guy immediately in front of me or behind me.
So in a nutshell, I’ll always support your ideas you come up with.
Just for something to think about for a future idea. How about a handicap system for a trial. For example the winner of the last race is given a time penalty in relation to the last guy and it’s graded down from second, third etc. Could mean all us slow coaches are kept within a chance of winning a stage occasionally. Yep it sounds like hard work to sort out but it could keep everyone competitive right up to the last round?
Hope to be back for the next round and once again thanks for the great job you are doing for us Mudcat.
4 Likes
Depends on how much you want it to count and effect the results. Going towards the individual rally is less valuable since it has a lower overall effect on the final outcome. Having it go towards the stage total is significantly more valuable as it directly translates into a 5 second advantage. I’m personally fine with either.
That’s actually not a terrible idea, kind of like balance of performance in GT racing. It would also make it so that everyone really has to push themselves for the win, you can’t just get a time buffer early on and coast from there. It could lead to some, er, “heated” discussions of exactly how much of a handicap to apply, but may be worth a look for the next season.
2 Likes
Handicapping would be difficult from the perspective of “what is par”. We could make a median or avg time between us par, but the bottom end can really drag that down, especially with DNF’s and basically push far more than half the drivers into a penalty.
The fairest way would probably be to select a par overall rally time, for instance 1 hour. Handicap above and below that, but to accurately get that kind of handicap it would take a lot of data over a lot of races to effectively “zero everyone out”. Could always car handicap too. Lots of options.
I think if we dabbled into handicapping it would be a side/additional “championship” scoring of sorts.
Just for giggles I ran numbers on Scotland, the avg of of just the cars left running is 1:12:18.28, the avg of everyone is 1:49:23.53 (thanks in large part to my unfortunate result).
The median of everyone is 1:12:38.51 and of those still running 1:06:50.22, which is actually close to what I thought the line should probably be for Group B (4WD), my guess is 1:05:00 on being par-ish