You know what I take from all the drama discussions? How passionate theese guys really are about flight sims. I can relate to that. We spend so much time on every module that all of it actually becomes a really big deal. Sorry to sound condescending, my intentions are the opposite. The discussion matters, but the subtext is always this unconditional love, an love can lead to disappointment sometimes. Anyway I’m always a hippie after Isakaya night. Sorry not sorry.


Indeed. And I think the developers are really passionate about it too. I mean, some of these guys have been doing it for decades (maybe even 30 years?)…and they keep coming back to it and wanting to provide an even better experience. There is no denying the progress, and when I look back on it, I’m amazed. I love it when a project sees the light of day, the developers have pride in it, and the community enjoys it. I’m good with criticism of anything as long as people also acknowledge the great progress too.


@taubkin Amen… I needed a hug yesterday. So instead of looking out the window waiting for the Farmer I got my VR all fixed up. Had a go at 4 A-4s in a MiG-21. It was quite a giggle. They take turns trying to kill ya.
@BeachAV8R I remember how the original il2 went through a development of better and meaner Ai. I’m still amazed today at how the AI dogfights. It’s so fluid how they respond to situations. Yeah a lot has happened in the last 15 years. The Hornet, Harrier and Tomcat are just unbelievable. The best time to be a sim pilot is here now


Yesterday I wanted to say basically what @BeachAV8R said about the amazing progress - but the conversation had kind of moved on and I didn’t want to get drag it back. But now that we’re still talking about module releases and the relating enthusiastic conversation - I guess it’s not out of place:

I’m sure it is easy to be disappointed and get caught in the emotion but the reality is we have it so, so good right now with flight sims and DCS.

I mean, back in the day we were excited about LOMAC, then Black Shark 1, then A-10C, years between releases…and look at the pace now: how many modules were released in 2016, like, six? I can’t find the time to learn my current modules properly, let alone new ones.

In 7 years we’ve gone from having a single one-purpose machine to fly around in a single map to over 20 aircraft in 4 beautiful maps and a new engine that we still can’t stop posting squillions of screenshots of, because it is just that pretty.

It’s hard to convey the tone right over the keyboard as I don’t mean to scold or sound condescending like @taubkin said - if anyone is frustrated it is because they are passionate about flight sims…all I’m saying is I wish that more people (not so much here but on other flightsim forums in particular) remembered to take a step back and really take stock of where we are - everyone was predicting the ‘death of flight sims’ at one point: just look at what we’re doing with our home PCs now! :slight_smile:


Crazier things have happened

As an American, my Japanese pickup truck which is named after a city in Washington state was made in Mexico.

Global economy FTW!


…you are a pilot at work…and the times you are not doing anything is when the plane is on AP…so…do the passengers?…well…these new planes essentially fly themselves…so…never mind. :wink:


Man…my days would go by so much faster if I were just in the airplane all day. Unfortunately, the vast part of my normal day is sitting in an FBO somewhere debating on whether I really need to eat another Otis Spunkmeyer cookie that the CSRs roll out. (Of course you eat them…you paid $300 to sit on their ramp all day…eat everything they put out!)


You should start an FBO with cookies and a fitness room!


Some FBOs actually do have fitness rooms. I really should avail myself of them at some point…but it would suck to be halfway through a sweaty workout and the heart team arrives back early (without calling) and are like “uh…we are ready to go…”


If there’s one thing I’ve learned over the years, it’s that programmers are not good PR people.

TK was the most egregious example, but there’s a reason why the big publishers have hard release dates for their stuff–the media campaign.

Yes, “it’s done when it’s done” is good for their reputation, good for the customers, but it’s antithetical to a marketing campaign where you start at a particular time (not too early! not too late!) for a given release.

So, in this case, the MiG-19’s marketing campaign and its internal development lost sync with each other. Not too surprising, really, that their PR was too optimistic. What is is that the 19 is supposed to come out in a better state than the Harrier is now? Ok, so when will the Harrier be there?


I see what you are getting at…kind of like the the whole "John Romero’s about to make you his B-Word PR fiasco. :open_mouth:


That, and the finance guys. Every week a product is delayed and not for sale, is another week that paychecks go out without cash coming in. This is why “it’s done when it’s done” simply doesn’t fly as an answer in the business world. “Everything is subject to change” also isn’t the most confidence inducing tag line to investors either…

I assume this all works in DCS land because:

  1. Most third party devs are small, independent teams that are likely riding payment from a previous product release.
  2. ED has carved a nice little niche and get’s to make it’s own rules as there’s no real competition.


Cautiously Posting This :smile:


Woo Hoo! This can only mean that the Mig-19 was released last night while we slept and the DCS-fairy has left all of us a serial number key under our pillow! :hugs::star_struck::hugs::star_struck: I am so excited! I’m going to check my pillow right now…

[a few moments later…off in the distance we hear an anguished cry]


You Sir…Are The Very Large Spoon that Stirs The Pot!!! :slight_smile: :slight_smile:


ROFLMAO!!! :joy: @Hangar200, drinks are on me!

@Phantom88 Thanks for your support. She’s looking good.:slight_smile:
The Imperialists continue to mock me as I try to run intercepts in my MiG-15 over Vietnam and middle East.
We need more Power!!! :astonished:


I have given this some thought.
There is no competition in the high end modern combat flightsim category.

Who would step up to the plate and deliver what ED has been supplying for the last decade, if they stopped…?

I don’t see anyone willing to take over such a demanding product, for such a return on investment.

That says a lot about our hobby…


Oh man, how unfair pitting the brand new Farmer against those older 3D models straight from 2011… :slight_smile:


No one. ED is the last ship in the sea. If you eliminate the SF series from TK as it was an indie release, how far back do you need to go to find one?

F4:AF maybe? Even that was a glorified mod of an older release.

I think Jane’s F/A-18 might have been the last original non-ED modern flight sim. So yeah…eggs in one basket much?


… or survival of the fittest?
Darwin, Charles; Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection
See chapter 3, Struggle for Existence…also applies to MP flying. :sunglasses: