Su-25 / A-10A Question

A question for you fast-moving gents out there. Are the ground units all snipers with their crew served weapons or is it completely hopeless to try and use the Su-25 or A-10A against anything but soft, undefended targets in DCS?

For example, I wanted to give the FC3 Su-25 campaign a shot, but I keep getting shwacked by German IFVs. I’ve been using S-25Ls from max range, starting my run at about 500 meters AGL and 550 kph, but by the time the rocket hits and I break away I’m well inside crew served weapon, MANPAD and AAA range. After about two or three iterations I’m a smoking hole.

Now, admittedly, I’m doing this all with my Rift, so the target acquisition is harder and forces me closer, but I still can’t help but feel I’m missing something. Higher altitude and steeper run-ins, more jinking and flares when I exit the WEZ, or should I just drop cluster munitions from 10,000 feet?

It is survivable. MANPADS are going to ruin your day - certainly if you are not popping flares as you enter/leave their WEZ. If you are in range of MANPADS, flares are mandatory. With DCS World 2.x it gets better as trees can block LOS to those ground units - meaning that they can see/fire through them and need to re-acquire.

One way to increase your time-to-live is to change your attack profile to ‘dive in’ at a steeper angle which allows you to, hopefully, minimize your time in their WEZ. That or standoff.

Helicopters have a harder time surviving than you do … so there is someone out there having a harder time :slight_smile:

Ha, I’m actually way more comfortable in a helo than fixed wing, even without collidable trees.

My problem doesn’t seem to be MANPADS as much as the LMG and HMGs on the vehicles. They seem to be laser guided…

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If the target is on a road or grouped, cluster munitions and one pass through and out and home.

The tendency will be to “finish up” - don’t. Get in. get out, go home and see where the campaign goes next. If you don’t like the results replay it but don’t turn back in. Oh - and free Two up to take some of the attention from you :wink:

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That might be the ticket. I’ll task Dash Two, take a nice turn in holding, then flow in when he has their attention.

Glad I’m not missing something obvious though, like Always Stay Above 15,000 Feet or APC CSW Are Broken or the like.

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If @bunyap2w1 cold war warrior campaign videos are correct, then it looks like a one pass and get out campaign type of thing.

The instant action target practice missions are pretty good too. I tend to vary the attack altitude, speed and angle when doing multiple passes.

It should be a rule of thumb ‘one pass and get out’.

It is just our ingame tendecy to load wide variety of munition and to destroy every-single-target. Good for training missions but not so much for any sort of campaign. Old habits die hard :slight_smile:

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Exactly. Chose a light loadout.

One pass, haul bottom :smiley:

Pump flares when you’re in hot and egress.

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Do not get in range of vehicle CSWs. Just don’t. While you can knock out 5 MBTs from 4km with impunity, at 2km a BTR-80 will shred you inside of 5 seconds.

AAA, SAMs, MANPADs…you can combat them with standard tactics and come out fine. Guidance by IR or radar can be countered. The AI’s eyes, however, cannot be, and unlike a human they have no dispersion or inaccuracy issues. Just watch the tracer fire from an IFV and you’ll watch every single round go to the same spot. Combine that with their perfection in leading you at any effective range and you don’t stand a chance. Forget radar or IR jammers, I want a smoke screen or cloaking device so they can’t see me as well!

My standard practice is to approach a target as fast as I can and then as soon as I’m in my engagement range I slow down/stop (in a helo)/turn HARD and engage beyond the range of the CSWs. Needless to say, this makes things like the laser-guided rockets on the Su-25 almost impossible to use because they don’t seem to go fast enough compared to the plane.

In fact, I have been shot down by many a unit AFTER I fired a weapon at them. I get in range, I launch, while weapon is inbound I get in their range, they launch, they die, I die. I saw them first (at least I think so). I definitely fired first. Yet their counter shot always gets fired back before they explode.

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Take the SAAB with standoff cluster munitions :slight_smile:
I always kill myself in an SU25 they are so unstable at speed

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I’ll try again today with a loadout of cluster munitions. At least those seem to work, so long as I can get the altitude right for them to disperse properly.

It’s just potential height boiling to get out :wink:

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That’s actually not a terrible idea, depending on your objectives and mission profile, assuming you have precision guided munitions.

Not really much for me to add here since others have covered it well but again, stay high. Gives you time to deal with SAMs and options for the attack. Two of my videos here may help.

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After revamping my tactics and loadout I’ve had much better success. One pass, CCRP with the bomblet dispensers, dispense, dispense, dispense and depart. The hardest part is target identification, but that won’t change until Gen. 2 VR. I am enjoying the simplicity of the FC3 avionics, too. Like a lot of folks, I’d love to see more FC3 level aircraft added to the mix!

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Great. The Frogfoot stands out a little from the other FC3 aircraft since it has AFM. I love the mix of realistic handling and not too deep systems fidelity.

Playing through this campaign really makes me wish it was also available for the Viggen. So far, the mission mix would be perfect for it.

If you have the inclination you could open the campaign missions in the ME and change the player plane to a Viggen then save them under new names.

I agree the Grach A has a really nice feeling to the flight model.

But all the other FC3 aircraft (except the MiG-29) also have AFM or better now.

Long time ago there was a video of Su-25 in DCS attacking column of artilery.
He was on the deck jinking wildly, streighten his wings slightly just for the pass and drop of the submunition dispensers and then jinked away from there. High speed.

Yes, he took some damage, sure he wasnt perfectly lined up with the column. But the ingress and egress looked so realistic and stuning. I think thats how it shold look like anyway. Not perfect, but no second pass, no bodies count.

This brings me back to an old idea. How about ‘Dead is Dead’ campaign thread? :wink:

PS: if somebody will be able to find that video that guy should definitely get some ‘archaeologist’ badge :slight_smile:

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