What to get next (DCS)?

So I’m finding myself looking for something different in my current stable of DCS modules. I’ve narrowed it down to either the MiG-21,the Mirage-2000, or picking up the NTTR. I’ve already got most of the rest (not counting whirlybirds and WW2, those are off the table currently), excluding the “trainer” A/C and the Harrier. I’ll through in that currently I really only fly SP, though I’ve debated dabbling in MP.

So there are a LOT of campaigns that require the NTTR, which I could avail myself to if I picked it up. Also it’d be somewhere else to fly over, which might be what I need to shake off some of the ennui I seem to have with my current stable. However as I do enjoy system simulations NTTR doesn’t offer that, so maybe it won’t scratch that itch.

The M-2000 is a nice mix of A2A and simple A2G (sort of the reverse of the Harrier), which covers a lot of areas of interest. Looking through Chuck’s guide and some reviews it does appear well modeled, and seems like a hoot to fly.

The MiG-21 has interested for a long time, and getting a chance to fly a virtual one has always been intriguing. Obviously it’s a lot less user friendly than the M-2000 both being older, and second being Russian (I kid… but it’s true). That is some of the appeal as well to be honest.

Each one is about the same price, so I’m just curious what peoples opinions of them are to make a better choice.



Only got the Mirage here. If you like going fast and vertical combat, the Mirage is your plane. Brush up on your French! It’s the only real air-to-air fighter I have and I got it during the sale, so comparatively speaking, didn’t pay much. I have fits with the missiles as it seems they are finiky on when and where they track, but I’m sure that’s just my lack of experience with the radar. The ECM package is awesome though, works pretty good. It’s a bit more modern than the Fishbed and will probably be more familiar to you. I actually enjoy gunfighting with it more than I do the missiles, just because those guns are hard to spoof and a pair of 30mils will eff anything up.

I’m more of a sturmovik guy myself, so I don’t fly the Mirage much. I extremely dislike the air-ground weaponry on the Mirage; difficult to employ. So if you’re all-in for air combat, it’s a great way to go – fast, maneuverable up to a point, and fly-by-wire.

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That’s a tough choice if you are only going to stick with one of them.

The M2000C is a lot of fun to fly. It is fairly simple to learn and comes with a great campaign set in the Caucus map. The fly by wire controls are nicely modeled. It’s a nice module and well worth picking up.

The MiG 21 is a quirky beast that will kill you in a heartbeat if you get slow when landing. The cockpit is an ergonomic nightmare, but that is part of its charm. I really haven’t flown it much, but then my interest is mainly in Western types (I love flying the MiG 15 though).

The NTTR is a neat map. I like it mainly because I fly into KLAS quite often for work, and so it is a very familiar area. I love blasting down the strip at Mach 1+ in VR, but that’s just me :).

Personally , I would get the M2000C, but it really comes down to what floats your boat.


Piling on @PaulRix’s comments about the Mig-21…

It is beast to fly…it doesn’t like slow and you can flame out in a heartbeat if you start yanking the throttle around or pull neg Gs for too long. If you pull too many positive Gs, weapons and gas tanks start falling off. Then gun takes something like four steps to arm and can jam (you get two tries to unjam it) The radar gets ground clutter if you even think about looking down at less that 3000 m AGL while at altitude, clouds/weather can clutter up the screen - there are controls to minimize both…just don’t keep it on too long or it will use up all its coolant and fry itself. Which is one reason why you need an A-50 or GCI site site to talk you into to a good intercept position before you turn the radar. Aside from AA-8’s its missiles psuck. The radar AA-2 bring true meaning to the concept of SAR. A2G is your typical selection of Soviet-era, bombs, rockets, one guided missile and a simulated Nuke that can take to most of an airfield…and you too if you mess up the bombing profile. It goes through gas like its running out of style…and don’t even think you can do a dead stick landing. There is a reason the jet has a drag chute…slow=death when landing…the power stays on…which can lead to landing long and looking at a rapidly diminishing runway…“go around or pop the chute?”…to late…you just ran out of runway and options…you sometimes find your self wishing that you had taken some damage over the target area so that you had reason to eject rather than attempt a landing.

…all of which is why I love that jet!

When you scramble start (it can be started in just over a minute), roar into the air going through your external tank before you know it, worked with GCI to get at a B-52’s “six”, send send two ATOLLs into it and still have to move into guns to deliver the coup de’gras and finally put the thing back on the ground, at the nearest divert field because you are about on fumes, rolling to a stop with maybe 3 feet of runway to spare (they wouldn’t have paved it all if they didn’t want you to use the whole thing)…that’s the kind of sense of success and accomplishment you can’t get with other fighters…just say’n.:sunglasses:


I’d say get NTTR because it’s NOT the Black Sea. I have it and the 21 but not the 2000, so I can’t really offer any thoughts on it beyond it didn’t interest me enough to pick it up. A later 2000 maybe, but not that early one.

The 21 is a classic “easy to fly, hard to master” type that lets you get in the air and gets guns kills without too much effort but after that is a steep cliff to climb to learn the rest.

While I like it, the limited options from its era to fly it with/against make it require specially tailored missions to get the most out of it. Instant action and most “laundry list” missions made with a dozen types per side leave it horribly outmatched.

I would say get NTTR first because it’s really good and whatever you fly can be used there. As you say, it also opens you up to the campaigns and missions (free and pay) made for it. It will breathe new life into all your other platforms.


It depends totally on what you want. If you already have the Persian Gulf map, NTTR for a desert map means a bit less than it would otherwise. That bit is up to you, so I’ll just compare the aircraft.

Both birds are delta wing (MiG-21 is a modified delta), so they both like to get fast and stay fast. Both can accelerate like nobody’s business, and the delta wing lets them keep that airspeed without as much induced drag. Both can make a high energy turn on a dime, but you will bleed to stall speed within 180 degrees if you attempt a bat-turn. Both planes are Fox1 capable (though the Mirage radar is better and easier, and the Super 530 is better than the R-3R and way better than the RS-2). Both startups are easy, though the Mirage takes longer because you need to align the INS. Otherwise, the planes are completely different.

The MiG-21 is a stick and rudder rocket sled that will scare the crap out of you at least once or twice every flight (not counting landing, which is a guaranteed scare). There are rudimentary autopilot controls (a dampener, low level pitch-up, and altitude hold), but it’s a high maintenance aircraft in that you have to keep track of a lot of things in a less-than-ergonomic cockpit. And that’s just flying the bird; fighting it is a totally new level of task saturation, not to mention setting up your pipper and switches properly for every weapon (selecting the sight and ballistic settings, selecting the seeker type, and selecting not only the proper station but the proper station corresponding to the proper mode on the same dial). Switching from missiles to guns in a turning fight can be so difficult it’s often easier just to keep eyes on the bandit and use Kentucky Windage to aim the cannon. The most fun I’ve had with the MiG-21 is flying that temperamental beast at low level, using the RATO for take-off, and firing the Grom at targets. All of those alone are worth the price of admission.

The Mirage is one of my favorite modules. Aside from being a delta wing, it is the opposite of the MiG-21. It is a fly-by-wire aircraft (well modeled by RAZBAM) with a G-limiter and it is easy to fly at high speed and low altitude. The autopilot is intuitive and powerful, and while it’s early 80s technology, you can do just about anything you want with the trim hat. Quite simply, if the Mirage scares you you’ve likely done something wrong! I usually recommend the Mirage as a good gateway for full-DCS modules, as it is a good introduction to a full-clickable cockpit while the autopilot allows you to explore the cockpit without worry and the systems are simple and intuitive enough to mostly set and forget and focus on fighting. Finally, the approach mode in the Mirage is nice, especially if you have the airfield as your final waypoint (it will give you a runway outline in the HUD for poor weather approaches). The HUD cues give you indications of acceleration (the two carots relative to your FPM, just like the regular HUD modes), and a staple gives you an ideal AOA to give you a feel for landing a delta wing. Just line up the FPM, staple, and carots on the runway threshold and ride it in, and you can also develop a good sight picture for the MiG-21 as well!

Ultimately, it boils down to whether you want a 4th gen FBW fighter, or a stick and rudder challenge.


Now you tell me. My “gateway” was the Mig-21…I am still in therapy.

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MiG-21 if you like challenging hand flying and steam gauges

M-2000 if you like digital systems and a HUD

NTTR if you like Red Flag and the color brown

Out of the three, I’d prefer the Fishbed. It’s awesome. Don’t forget to check out the dynamic campaign from @MBot (although you will need Nevada and the Fishbed)

Good replies all.

How is NTTR as far as hardware requirements, more taxing than the default black sea terrain? Reason I ask is that these days I do most of my flying on my laptop, which is several years old at this point and starting to show it’s age.

I’ve gotta admit I’m kinda leaning towards the Mig-21 just for the “hard to master part” at the moment.

NTTR’s requirements seem to be lower than Caucasus, at least for me.

Maybe except when you fly low level over the strip… :scream:

Hmmmm what would i vote for as the next thing in DCS…


As someone will all the products you mention, I’d say the Mig-21 is indeed your best bet. Assuming you already have the Hornet, the M2K (while still a better pure interceptor) will feel like a less versatile aircraft, given it’s lack of A2G options, and limited A2A payload (with the latest updates, you can roll full SPAMRAAM in a 'bug). My M2k gathers dust now that I have the Hornet. To be clear, the M2K is an excellent module, it’s just I’ve little motive to fly it in a post-hornet world.

As per Nevada: I will sometimes fire that up in the mission editor when I want to do some ‘bomb-range’ style missions to play with a new toy, or blast out a canyon run ending with a fly-by of the hoover dam. I figure “I have it, might as well use it.” I tend to do most of my flying in the PG now. Of note, I generally build my own missions in the MG, opposed to campaigns.

That said, the Mig-21 will give you the most diversity against all the other products you mention, and is worth having in your stable. I’d definitely not make it a “daily driver” though.


Thanks everyone. I pulled the trigger on the Mig-21 last night, haven’t had a chance to take it up yet though.


Agree with one caveat. To become proficient in the Mig21, you do need to fly it-and only it-daily for a week or so. I spent an hour or so just with the landing tutorial-set a goal to land correctly two times in a row…i finally succeeded when I decided that blowing the main mount tires, but not collapsing the landing gear, counted as a successful landing. :sunglasses:


If you are ever interested in doing some multiplayer in the Mig-21bis, give me a holler. :wink:

So I picked up the MiG-21 the other day. First off, this suckers still in early access for years later? I didn’t mind not being able to use my bonus, but really 4 years? Oh well more bonus to get the next module.

Suckers a hoot to fly and fight, but it seems like there are some glaring systems modeling issues. PRMG (IlS) appears to be non-functional, the sight appears to be partially functional, etc. Looking up issues on the MiG pretty much returns 4 year old forum threads, and even browsing through the various bug forums over on the DCS forums I’m not having much luck figuring out what is currently broken.

Does anyone have any idea where to find a list/doc/whatever that has a rundown of the current status of the MiG? I probably spent a full evening trying to figure out what I was doing wrong the with PRMG before I found out it’s broken currently (not sure if that’s due to DCSW updates or what), and I’d like to avoid that hassle again.

Interesting…it does say Early Access!…I never noticed.

I’m pretty sure that is just something that somebody forgot to erase.

Re PRMG…my snarky answer would be “well…don’t fly in bad weather and you won’t have to use it…problem solved.” :wink:

Actually I have never used it because I can barely get the jet down in clear weather with no wind (I think I don’t have autopilot in stabilization mode) so cannot say for sure that it works. I can say that RSBN and ARK work…and provide musical beeps that I like to call the Mikoyan and Gurevich symphony 21 in D minor; “Fishbed”

That said, I found this link that may help

In case anyone else is looking for it, here’s the Leatherneck simulation online bug tracker: My View - Leatherneck Simulations Bugtracker It’ll let you know anything and everything that anyone thinks is wrong.

So apparently the PRMG is fixed-broken on a regular basis with the DCS World updates. Right now it just flat out doesn’t have a glide slope, and half the time it does have azimuth either. Makes night flying…exciting?

The trick I’ve found to putting the MiG-21 down is to think of trying to go for a REALLY low pass down the centerline of the runway. You’re not landing the sucker so much as letting it sink down onto the pavement with the gear down. I’m getting about 50% good landings currently, and I haven’t fireballed in a while, so improvements!


I haven’t tried PRMG but last time I flew the Caucus map, RSBN worked fine.

Today I tried the PG map…nothing…PRGM or RSBN…or ARK for that matter.

So what is up with this?

Why the lines for Tumb, Bandar Abbas Int’l 30R and Lar not shaded? Or why are all the others shaded? The ARK doesn’t work at all.